What are the best classes & specs for each different role?

[Awkwardlol]

Nice try on the amazing shit post, once again, you lost clueless person. Also, this isn't about hating on Prot Paladins (I don't care), please save yourself before it's too late, Killerduki the Clueless (The Private Server Hero)

That comment brough me to chunk my head of reading mentally ill kid who won world championship that never end which gave him medal of being biggest retard.

See Theloras why i don't give a shit about the stupid trolls?! . . In topic where we discuss about Protection Paladin he come up with bullshits about specific bossfight on modified privacy server.

The next time instead apologize i will feel free to give him candy's for being biggest kid in privacy servers.

Just to remind that 5 other people have even talk/mention about chromaggus resistance before even i say anything about it, but this kid decide to pull out all on me.. and said nothing about them.

I am happy that i will keep him on foe so i wont disturb same as i did toward some other trolls.

lmfao 10/10 deflecting again, your posts are getting worse and worse Killerduki the Clueless

PS, You still didn't link the Holy Vulnerability Spell, rip

[Aethelwulf]

How are they on a "losing side"? Can pally tank? Yes. Best AOE tank, best TPS off tank due to not needing to take damage for rage. Warrior is best single target hard hitting boss tank.

If you're complaining about being rage-limited, you're probably not a very good Warrior.

[Theloras]

How are they on a "losing side"? Can pally tank? Yes. Best AOE tank, best TPS off tank due to not needing to take damage for rage. Warrior is best single target hard hitting boss tank.

You confuse the ignorance of the masses as the winning side, because more people have a tunnel vision mentality. I (a warrior) have given great information on available pally tank loot, where they excel, why even on a tauntable boss 1 can be used.

If you're complaining about being rage-limited, you're probably not a very good Warrior.

He was referring to having a Warrior building up threat as the off-tank compared to a Paladin being the off-tank.

In that situation, the Paladin off-tank would blow a Warrior out of the water on threat.

[Aethelwulf]

The Paladin still has to work up his threat to an off-tank worthy level first.

You have no confirmation that there was spell damage scaling during vanilla in the first place. Your side of the argument has no merit since it is running off of pure hearsay from years later to infer that this was the case during vanilla and not, for instance, early Burning Crusade.

Which is why I submitted a GM ticket on Battle.net and asked Blizzard directly...

I'm not sure how many times it needs to be pointed out to you until it sinks in to your thick skull, but what the GM said is itself hearsay from many years later. The GM himself cautioned that he did not know for certain and had no official information on the subject when he responded. You are engaging in precisely the kind of stupidity the GM essentially warned you not to do (ie. taking his word for certified proof).

The argument that the video comes from a private server also strikes me as unlikely since private servers didn't really catch on until after TBC came out and if you are drawing attention to the grounding totem behavior displayed, a lot of procs in WoW do operate as spells and thus are eligible for grounding totem.

These items are entirely unique in all of WoW - never again did Blizzard attempt to introduce similar items which had a guaranteed +Fire/Nature spell effect on every hit. This type of effect is different from Thunderfury for example in that for the Thunderfury +Nature dmg bonus, that effect is rolled into the white dmg unlike the +Fire/Nature dmg which are coded as separate instant cast spells on every white hit that lands.

That's not an answer. Ignoratio elenchi, as we call it.

As far as the Grounding Totem video goes, can you confirm when it was actually recorded (RECORDED, as in not uploaded to YouTube). Similarly, can you confirm on what server it was recorded as well? Was it on a live retail Vanilla server, a retail PTR server, a live private server or a private PTR server?

Strictly speaking, no. But it can be reasonably inferred that it was from vanilla. Most videos back then are from vanilla, and back during vanilla private servers were horribly underpopulated and we can easily see a number of people lolling about outside Orgrimmar in this video. It can also be inferred that Storm Gauntlets did not scale in vanilla because they are an obvious Shaman item and Shamans gear spell damage so it would have become widespread knowledge if Storm Gauntlets were so hideously powerful.

While both sides of the argument had merit, no one piece of evidence was the coup de grace because there are no official patch notes to refer to, nor are there player comments from the Vanilla period on Wowhead or Allakhazam to refer to either.

You dunce. You still don't have any evidence whatsoever from vanilla backing up your assertion. That's zero evidence. None whatsoever. Just rumors and hearsay from years later that it scaled sometime back which you insist had to be during vanilla. Even though it would've made the items so ridiculously powerful that people should have noticed. Ergo, your side has no merit.

Never mind the fact that in the end, the Peenix Devs removed the scaling for one simple reason: Fire Rogues were becoming too detrimental to the server as a whole.

That's a lovely digression but I'm going to cut you off there because it doesn't answer anything regarding actual vanilla.

[Theloras]

The Paladin still has to work up his threat to an off-tank worthy level first.

Which is easy as piss for the Paladin to do while off tanking because he isn't reliant on incoming damage to fuel his threat generation.

As far as your obsession with beating a dead horse over the spell dmg items, it's not worth quoting again. You have your opinion and I have mine. We can agree to disagree and it's as simple as that but at least I went out of my way to get an answer from Blizzard directly in order to make a "reasonably inferred" opinion on the matter as you put it.

That video proves nothing on its own for the reasons I previously listed but it doesn't matter in the end because spell dmg scaling was removed for one reason only: Fire Rogues.

"You dunce. You still don't have any evidence whatsoever from vanilla backing up your assertion. That's zero evidence. None whatsoever. Just rumors and hearsay from years later that it scaled sometime back which you insist had to be during vanilla. Even though it would've made the items so ridiculously powerful that people should have noticed."

You do realize that people also said that Seal Twisting was impossible in Vanilla as well right?

[Spell] [PALADIN] Seal Twisting in Vanilla (SoC + SoR)
https://github.com/FeenixServerProject/ ... ssues/4025

I proved all the trolls and doubters wrong on that one.

[Aethelwulf]

The Paladin isn't reliant on incoming damage to fuel his threat generation.

Odd, because I recall hearing that Blessing of Sanctuary, Holy Shield, and Retribution Aura with Righteous Fury are a solid part of how Paladins obtain their threat.

As far as your obsession with beating a dead horse over the spell dmg items, it's not worth quoting again. You have your opinion and I have mine. We can agree to disagree and it's as simple as that but at least I went out of my way to get an answer from Blizzard directly in order to make a "reasonably inferred" opinion on the matter as you put it.

I'll admit I had a good chuckle at your "You have your opinion and I have mine." It's not a matter of opinion. It's a matter of evidence. And frankly, yours remains garbage. Also, inferring the Blizzard rep's word as fact when he goes out of his way to inform you that he does not know for certain and that he has no official information on the subject (and in the face of evidence to the contrary, no less) is decidedly not a reasonable inference. It is so stupid as to become comical.

Well, since apparently not even a video from vanilla is evidence enough for you, have some more evidence from the Vanilla Storm Gauntlets Thottbot. Notice the following comments:

• "fairly amusing when the 3 lightning damage starts critting for 4 or 5 points of damage"
• "The +3 Nature Damage occurs on EVERY melee attack. Also, although of no real value, is that it can "crit" for 4 or 5 damage, and if you are a Shaman with Windfury on, when windfury procs, the Storm Gauntlets triple proc, it's actually pretty funny."

Now bear in mind that Storm Gauntlets is itself a spell damage item and that Lightning damage is actually Nature damage in vanilla, meaning Storm Gauntlets should scale with its own spell damage if it scaled as you so obstinately insist.

So, again: Storm Gauntlets did not scale you absolute nincompoop.

That video proves nothing on its own for the reasons I previously listed but it doesn't matter in the end because spell dmg scaling was removed for one reason only: Fire Rogues.

Your continual deflections towards the subject of Feenix remain useless in a topic about actual vanilla behavior.

Seal Twisting

Not even going to bother looking into it. Just going to note that no one cares because that's a different topic.

[Noselacri]

I like how they started out violently flaming anyone who had any differing opinion, and now that everything they've said has been proven wrong, they try to play "you have your opinion, I have mine."

[Theloras]

I like how they started out violently flaming anyone who had any differing opinion, and now that everything they've said has been proven wrong, they try to play "you have your opinion, I have mine."

You still have yet to point out when and where I have lied in this post or any other thread on these forums Noselacri - here's a refresher for you:

https://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic. ... 50#p155975

[Theloras]

@Aethelwulf and his continuing of beating a dead horse of a non issue that has no bearing on Nostalrius whatsoever.

For the record, this is why the Penix Devs nerfed the items:

Testing Fire Rogue - Pre Live 1.12 (Test Realm)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZC5YeqkNxA

It's not a matter of opinion. It's a matter of evidence. And frankly, yours remains garbage.

Yours is still garbage on the basis of that video alone - we don't know when it was recorded (what patch) or whether it was on a live server, a ptr server or a private server - we also don't know if the items came out and originally scaled and were nerfed or came out without scaling but were hotfixed to scale after.

Without patch notes, we have no official viewpoint on which to rely on - hence why I asked Blizzard directly...

TLDR - The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

If you weren't such a dunce, you would review the other bug tracker post which showed me proving that Seal Twisting was possible during Vanilla even if it wasn't discovered until TBC:

[Spell] [PALADIN] Seal Twisting in Vanilla (SoC + SoR)
https://github.com/FeenixServerProject/ ... ssues/4025

You were probably have been one of the trolls who bitched and moaned at me that Seal Twisting wasn't possible and that I was a tool for trying to get the dev there to implement it.

[Aethelwulf]

his continuing of beating a dead horse of a non issue that has no bearing on Nostalrius whatsoever.

I seem to recall you were more than happy to kick up an argument on this point, but now that it is obvious that you are losing, it has become a "dead horse" we shouldn't concern ourselves with. Incidentally, the phrase "dead horse" typically indicates that the argument has already run to its conclusion. Shall I take this for a tacit admission that you recognize you've already been proven wrong?

Feenix

It's still irrelevant. Stop trying to distract the issue.

Yours is still garbage on the basis of that video alone

Calling it garbage does not make it so. And you are really trying to close your eyes to the vanilla thottbot evidence as well.

we don't know when it was recorded (what patch) or whether it was on a live server, a ptr server or a private server - we also don't know if the items came out and originally scaled and were nerfed

Technically these are indeed all possibilities. The private server remains distinctly unlikely, and if it is a PTR, that would still prove that official servers did not scale Storm Gauntlets.

or came out without scaling but were hotfixed to scale after.

Now this. This is hilariously absurd. A hotfix to introduce spell scaling on an ability that procs with every hit? Well, thank you for the laugh.

Without patch notes, we have no official viewpoint on which to rely on - hence why I asked Blizzard directly...

And the Blizzard GM told you that he was unable to obtain any official information on the subject, leaving you with his hazy recollections after cautioning you that he does not know for certain. This isn't school where you get points for effort. You only get points for being right. I think we've been over this a number of times already, so how about you just admit the GM's word is hearsay by his own admission and move on?

TLDR - The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

You know Theloras, if you're going to try to sound smart, at least make sure to understand what you are saying. Lets list the amount of things wrong with this.

1. What you are attempting to do with this phrase is declare "If you can't prove it isn't true, I still have a point." You know you're losing an argument when you're resorting to this to plead your case.
2. You are misunderstanding the principles of falsifiability and burdens of proof in an argument. Simply because "absence of evidence is not proof of absence" does not mean that "absence of disproof is proof of existence" either. Feel free to google the "Flying Spaghetti Monster" for an example. You need to prove why you are right in the first place.
3. I actually do have evidence of absence. Refusing to acknowledge it doesn't make it go away.
4. That phrase is a brightline for deductive reasoning. Absence of evidence can still be indicative of absence in matters of inductive reasoning. For instance, Storm Gauntlets are a shaman item. Vanilla WoW players numbered in the millions such as can be inferred there existed a sufficiently large body of shaman players who used Storm Gauntlets. Spell damage scaling is extremely powerful. Shamans gear spell damage and would notice the scaling. Players gravitate towards more powerful builds. Therefore, if Storm Gauntlets scaled, it is extremely probable that players would have both noticed and popularized it. As per modus tollendo tollens, if there is no recognition of it scaling, that would indicate Storm Gauntlets did not scale. (This logic can also be applied with Fiery Retributer and Fiery Plate Gauntlets for Paladins. To a lesser extent also Blazefury Medallion for Druids.)

Seal Twisting

Remains irrelevant. We're not discussing seal twisting here.

You were probably have been one of the trolls who bitched and moaned at me that Seal Twisting wasn't possible and that I was a tool for trying to get the dev there to implement it.

Congratulations, now you are reaching for a poisoning the well fallacy by making assumptions about my behavior on Feenix. I was never on Feenix. I'm sure it's comforting to insist that everyone who considers you a moron is a troll determined to hound you, but consider the simpler possibility that you are actually a moron and your disinformation makes people feel the need to correct you..